Dr Nicole Noel, Dr Magella M. Neveu, Miss Pei-Fen Lin

For the 10th International Day of Women and Girls in Science, we asked three leading staff members at Moorfields and UCL Institute of Ophthalmology to discuss UNESCO’s theme: closing the gender gap in science.’

We also asked about their role models, and whether they had any reflections on progress in gender equality that they had noticed over the past 10 years. Below are some of the thoughts they shared. 

Dr Nicole Noel: honorary research fellow at the UCL Institute of Ophthalmology

I’m Nicole Noel, a research fellow and principal investigator at UCL’s Institute of Ophthalmology. I focus on research of the aging retina to identify contributing factors that lead to age-related macular degeneration, so that we can develop new therapeutic interventions to stop people from losing vision.

Only about 30% of global researchers are women at this point in time, with fewer than that in leadership positions. In some places, the gender gap for education in the sciences is closing, but it’s not reflected in professorships and leadership positions. So ensuring that women are supported and not penalised for potential career breaks related to things like pregnancy, including pregnancy loss, and parental leave or carer responsibilities is absolutely necessary.

Women are more likely to be given administrative tasks that don’t benefit them and may take time and energy away from duties that are actually part of their role. Sharing responsibilities evenly is essential for everybody’s success.

One really important role model for me was, and still is, Dr Jennifer Hocking at the University of Alberta in Canada. She is a vision scientist as well. As I was starting my research career, Dr Hocking was making the transition from postdoctoral fellow to assistant professor. She had a reputation for being very insightful, and for asking the difficult questions that really made people think about what they were doing and why they were doing it. When I was a PhD student, I asked her to be on my supervisory committee because I knew that she would make me a better scientist.

In the last ten years, there’s been a lot more emphasis on complex identities that people may have. Someone maybe a woman, but also disabled, or from a different cultural background. It’s important we acknowledge that people are not just one thing, and that they are an accumulation of their different experiences. Those experiences are all valuable. Having diversity within our teaching environments and research environments everywhere enriches everything and makes us better.

Dr Magella M. Neveu: consultant clinical scientist and lead healthcare scientist in the Electrophysiology Department at Moorfields Eye Hospital

Most people know me as Maj. I work as a consultant clinical scientist in the electrophysiology department. I am also the operational lead and the quality lead. As the Trust’s lead healthcare scientist, I represent the specialism of Ophthalmic and Vision Science locally and nationally.

The gender gap exists and is getting smaller, but it’s nowhere near where it could be. There is work going on in the background to encourage young women into healthcare science. We have healthcare science ambassadors, for example, who go to colleges and schools around London. A few of us here at Moorfields also speak in primary schools, but I think more needs to be done.

I think it also involves challenging and reshaping the male mentality towards female progression in science and medicine. That for me, comes from the influence of male members of my family, particularly my father and my husband, who were and are always encouraging, and never made me feel that because I’m a girl or a woman, I shouldn’t go for it. So it’s not just about promoting the women, it’s also about changing the mindset of the men.

In a male dominated environment, there can be this bravado and expectation that you give up everything to succeed. That’s not necessarily how it should be. You can be a woman and still have a family and be very successful in your career. You don’t have to be someone who works all hours and never sees your family or friends. Women shouldn’t have to be like men or strive to meet unhealthy expectations often to achieve. The fields of science and medicine will change as more and more uniquely female qualities exude into these environments and that can only be a good thing. So I would encourage women to be who you are.

My first and utmost role model was my mum. My mum was a nurse for 40 years and she worked in various areas of nursing, in geriatrics, and to the latter part of her career, in mental health. My dad, when I was a teenager, due to ill health couldn’t continue in the work that he was doing. So my mum became the main earner of the family. I saw my mum taking on that challenge so wonderfully. Being a mum now myself, I realise it must have been very difficult for her to support dad and at the same time, to be the breadwinner of the family. To work nights and come in, cook, clean, make sure we were okay whilst dad wasn’t well, and then start all over again. So mum was my inspiration.

Other women who inspired me were the human computers’ of NASA, portrayed in the film Hidden Figures’. Annie Easley and Katherine Johnson, were young black women working in a male dominated and racially toxic environment. What they did and achieved back in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, very few people knew about. Yet they were instrumental and key to the NASA rocket science project.

I think there should be more targeted programmes, and I think they should be very much driven by women in the profession. Difficult questions should be tackled and addressed by those with experience. For example, one of the challenges and questions raised by women when they come into a profession is, How is my career going to progress if I want to have a family?’ That’s very well supported now in the majority of professions, but very often women will delay having a family to progress their career. It’s not a choice that a man has to make, necessarily.

As I mentioned before the mentality of the people that surround you, such as friends, family and colleagues can be a tremendous and continuing support to enable you to achieve. Yes, we can have programmes that reach out to young women and say, Be a chemist, be a biologist, come into medicine.’ But I think there also needs to be programmes that support women emotionally, because breaking the mould’ is not just a one-off event. They may have got into the programme, but they may need that support all the way through if they’re going to succeed.

Miss Pei-Fen Lin: consultant ophthalmic surgeon and clinical director of Digital Innovation at Moorfields Eye Hospital

My name is Pei-Fen Lin. I’m a consultant ophthalmic surgeon here at Moorfields. My other hat is the digital innovation lead for Moorfields as well. For my clinical work, I specialise in cataract surgery, general ophthalmology, and also emergency eye care. For the digital side, which is a passion of mine, I try to promote digital innovation in medicine, in health tech, and healthcare.

I think science and medicine traditionally is quite male dominant, and I think to close the gap is really to make girls and women aware that science is for everybody. I try very hard to encourage my trainees, both men and women, to kind of showcase themselves, and tell people what they’re about.

Often I find that if I have an opportunity in my mind, I may think of someone not based on their gender, but based on how they represent themselves to me. It‘s quite interesting to see that my male trainees are more vocal about their achievements. They will come to me and say, I’ve done this, I can do this, and I can do that’.

I think sometimes what happens is that women are too polite about their achievements, or we tend to feel bad talking about our achievements. So often with my female trainees, I hardly know what they’ve done. If they’ve published a paper, I don’t really know about it. If they did an amazing project in their spare time, I don’t know about it. So it’s encouraging women to make people aware that actually they have done all these things.

In terms of role models, I think my dad would have the most influence. He was very inspiring because nothing is gender specific to him. He’s happy to do housework, but at the same time when he’s at meetings, he is the boss. So he sort of instilled that belief into me and my siblings. Growing up I don’t think I ever saw myself as, because I’m a woman I can’t do this.’ That wasn’t a belief.

With a colleague of mine, we set up the Big Girls Club’, as a cheeky counter to the Old Boys Club’. We invite female ophthalmic trainees to get together and talk about career plans, what we can share as consultants, how we’ve achieved our current role, and what difficulties, or what situations we’ve encountered. It’s to have a safe environment for people to share stories, and to meet different people at different stages of their careers, or studies, or lives. It’s almost like a support group, you have very organically formed mentors and mentorships together.

It’s interesting that a lot of health tech and digital innovations, if you look at Silicon Valley, and Google, and all these tech companies, are very male dominant. A lot of the apps are designed, or a lot of products are designed forgetting that there are women’s needs as well. Your iPhone has a lot of these health measurements, but there wasn’t a female voice in there. So tracking your period was not in the original design. To design a health app that doesn’t monitor a normal female bodily function seems ridiculous.

I think that shows the importance of change. A lot of studies, a lot of research of symptoms and diseases were based on male populations, but nowadays they’re a bit more balanced. So that will benefit how we develop medicine and treatment in the future. The female tech space has definitely blossomed over the last few years. So I think there is a trend in both the workforce, and how we look at medicine as a science, to get more well-rounded input. That’s really good.

Dr Louise Wood CBE: chair of our board of trustees

Dr Louise Wood shared her thoughts on these reflections. 

We have heard brilliant observations from some of the women who are helping to shape our institutions. I’m sure that many of the things they have said will resonate with our supporters. There have been significant improvements in the past 10 years, but there is still a way to go. We need to ensure that support is available in and out of work, that responsibilities are shared, and that we showcase inspiring stories and achievements. Targeted programmes for employment, training, and research are helping to close the gender gap. We are starting to see those gains in women’s careers, employment satisfaction, healthcare technology, research, and in treatments as well. This gives me hope.